Managing Your Cyber Career & Job Hunt

[Applause] thanks everybody about it my name is Bob wheeler I'm from clear jobs I'm an entire sector jobs comm one of the one of the people sure who does not really play with computers a whole lot cooter one time and now I work for job more directly to different job boards what we help connect job seekers to recruiters hire banner and some of the things that we do part that is outreach to job seekers to help but if we can start to learn a little more about how the jobs process works how the hiring process works how its really benefits everyone to include thank you folks out there whether you're looking for a job right

now whether your student just really quickly out of the showing hands up how many folks here are like looking for a job like right now okay how many folks here are currently students are there the program for school okay how many folks for the audience here are currently active duty military veterans or or recently got out of it that way okay so we're going to talk tough all those things a little bit get a little you know basically as we break it down we're gonna talk about the current landscape second particular because one of the things that you got to watch out for some people start saying well here's exactly to the job well every community

is different every organization is different every ecosystem and InfoSec is definitely to an ecosystem and there's even need to go supervisor knows that they can be a little different we're going to talk about the hiring process we're going to talk about how to build or a little bit about job boards and job fairs what you could do with those resumes interviews and then finally you've got the job now look I will tell you that in an hour or 45 minutes or whatever I room there's so much to talk about it here I'm not gonna get into the weeds on everything I'm just not getting better so what I'm going to tell you the things that we're going to focus on in

this particular topic is going to be the hiring process part building the network and we're going to talk about place-based a bit those are those are give me that the main focus is so many other things I'm just going to kind of hit the wave tops up so first let's talk about the current landscape you know when we talk about the landscape of enforce and cybersecurity it's the hot it's the trendy topic right everybody wants to be some of you folks here maybe this is what you've been doing your whole entire life you grew up with computers and going forward for the last five to 15 more maybe more years there's other folks here who's you know I talked

to someone in there coming out of the army who did something completely different HVAC tech person but he's making the transition going to schools going to come out of college which is InfoSec degree and looking at it in that direction you know so when you look at this you know it is its own special thing and you need to understand your place in the landscape as well because we look at you know things that stuff on the news all over the place you know workforce shortage 1.8 million people 0% that was the headline how many people here looking for does that mean you know well it's part of that's because it's not the same thing I mean you know in

being a job seeker still is easy you know is the Cisco job market over overcrowded you know there's still lots of things going on so just because this is an in-demand and you still sensory demand and it is technically what's called a negative unemployment maybe there are words over jobs it doesn't mean that everybody in that place is looking for the right job so there's other things play into that and that's why it's important to not just be smart but to really understand the job market and to know that the way things are working you know for example when the when a there was a survey us face respondents this was a business acute the skills of interest these are the

things that people are saying they're scares so if these are the things that you're doing but more importantly these are the kind of things that you're going to if you're doing these things you want to find or hire these skills what's going on their company and in their area another part mentor when the job market is whether your interest level personal or senior level person this is a really fascinating you know they need surveys talk about job seekers insist on positions with the US wouldn't double the share of employers they're looking for systems remember we said there was zero percent employment you know and why are people finding jobs well basically when indeed when that survey was saying

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you know yourself but so we really want to understand the whole you push if they push you pull it's about using the momentum that's already going to max and when you understand the hiring process a little more you can do the same thing how the process works so that then you can maximize and you can also mitigate you know banging your head

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a lot better if the hired manager instead the site I need somebody with ethical hacking and blah blah blah blah if they see something like hey here's this guy Tristan I meant besides I think mixed recruiters job easier to find interesting because the recruiter gets paid for bringing people they're going to get on so if you can network your way into knowing the right people that can help you out quite a bit now each one of these job process is also unique this is something else that I think a lot of job seekers really don't quite grasp understand you know the each recruiter is act and each hiring manager may or may not have more than one position that

they're looking to fill so when you're talking to a recruiter for some of a recruiter might have four times higher majors could be from the same company could have five jobs in between different hiring managers and this is why you might go to your you know I don't know it's because and when you have to see people trying to sort this is also can explain a little bit why recruiters may be you know sometimes it's because I just don't have the information you use of new topics and application you might even make emotional but it also one of those hiring managers is not how to loop the recruiter no longer has information on what's going on exists an operational

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process but the recruiting plug can be different so when you can you can start to ask the right questions take your recruiter job you know this is this program and if you don't do you know why the range of this program it's okay go ahead you can find that person on LinkedIn now but if you don't understand the whole process one can pass the right questions sometimes by the way if it has any questions feel free to raise your hand we got we got plenty of time on everything so now there's preferred sources there's a way

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your position that you can fill that pipeline do you know we're going to talk about that a second but is anybody here from when asked by the company to give a referral like who do you know what kind of responsibilities you'd be able to give someone's name would you just name your boss yeah Shawn hey Shawn says we should hire Joe soy sauce and Joe Oh six months later because he's off the drum you know so you're right you're putting your reputation on the line so that's don't want to and I've been in that situation you don't so if you want to become an internal referral if you know this song you know that Shawn

versus a company you want to work for is it just no Shawn just because you're better chicken place language with it he's not gonna throw you work for that but if you looking for entry-level positions and he says oh that's really cool you know where you gonna be at the you [Music] go there if you can slowly the lit up eventually you can smile says we got what I bet this guy besides last couple times I've seen what he's doing I think we should check him out you know so you can't find internal referrals Mexican was so this is where they got those are the Kruegers and sorcerers doing Bresnik job boards ISM and they're going to job

here they're setting up the table and besides now you know they're going to professional conferences other places to be folks so they could nobody do anybody

to post it out they're just so fun they've probably gone through all of these things first right so but let's look at these differences this is where managers like to start right and then we don't know what makes these managers who want to get the job done in businesses who want to hire those and make money and be a successful company they start there but where do most job seekers start most job seekers are coming out of college coming over coming out of the army looking for another position whatever they're like let me get a look on let me just see your time who's got jobs posted this is the worst place to start this is

good career intelligence but by no means the end-all be-all of getting your next 10% of what you really need because just seeing your back just by being in these sides your [Music] like Sean somebody else's can refer you you're getting to know me you know and then eventually get it work for a great company you get into no promotional someday alright so network who here loves

networking is not just about talking to somebody on the bus and it's not a dirty word and if you're in the military you start doing if you're in college is not something you do after graduation networking is a highly important the best way to put it it's just marinating in your profession it is always be in there asking questions if we're going to talk about the different things you can do to network you know it's professional development you look at this b-sides as a networking event where millions of professional development of it you guys I'm talking about don't really care about you know something else how many speakers are here their first time speakers there's a high school kid

right about that you know they're excited about being the first time speaker that's part of never forgetting yourself at that you know what that person is engaged in to what they're passionate about it's also getting any help from others and being cool down because networking is something that you don't just go around the differ who can have me because if we don't did that nothing would ever get done real networking is also

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[Music] first of all because if you're looking to give us a complete you know if you were 45 or 50 year old army infantry officer you just want to give it to cyber security I think I'm difficult because most of the opportunities for your skill sets would be entry-level you may not be looking for that they're patient wise if you're looking to progress your career you know kind of up and down wise then it's really become a big thing about being professionally engaged being here talking to people know those types of decisions when they're gonna hire annexes though or they're gonna hire a VP about you something like that those decisions are such a big risk management

I need to joke but I can factor they're being important decisions so it's not something to take lightly so they're gonna want to get to know you a lot you know so it's becoming on being on rewards for things you know you could be a leader to decide to Gus you know being a leader at you know volunteering to teach things because it's those jobs that is all about networking question yes all right so we said it's not what you know it's who you know right everybody not what you know it's who you know just is that fair most people say no most people say that's not what about what if I'm great you know what if I'm awesome you know if

you're a genius and nobody knows so that means what we need to make sure we know everybody right we want to know everybody because it's also not just what you know and who you know it's who knows you but it's also how well they know you and we kind of told the story you got to tell me what's your passion because you know what if you're an idiot if you're an idiot that knows everybody guess what everybody knows you did not just you know my name is Bob and I'm you know it's not just regurgitating that it's about telling people what you do it's about being able to show people what you do and doing it a little more

slowly and methodically the right time is what's going to really get you there you know other parts it's really amazing because if you come out of the service 9 to 20 years the name so I think I know what it's like to be in the service when you're doing this and you have the first sergeant's and you have a chief petty officer you better not be on social media you know and then how do we how do you like that everybody wouldn't the military's on Twitter that's something you know Twitter is really its cybersecurity wise it looks like when your community is more Twitter focused than probably any other community that I know about this

has cut the apron for jobs in let's say it's where I belong exceeds the fact so if you're coming out of the service or here in college right now you're not there are you really engaged in the cyber community kind of look at the little brochure that's out there for all the speaker's you see everybody's wondering you know so you have to do with those things you can follow and you can follow events you can follow the b-sides you know Augusta page you see all these companies you can as you're following those things you can follow other things like that if you are seekers if you want to follow with searching organizers that you want to

follow see with and when you get in there you can even see whom they bop you start pulling this rim non-stop you realize oh my god realize how many companies hire Tiger books carry us a question the backers [Music]

that happens a lot that's one of the things about Twitter is that you can't you don't get to accept to follow you you know so now what I would tell you is if somebody just follows you you know and this is ID one reason the cyber computer Justin more anonymous and you certainly want to watch out which are tweeting out there or something like that but if someone just follows to follow but if it's a company that you know who's in this conference who's gonna be hacker who's doing this and they start looking at maybe we start putting pieces together and then they start to woo you a little bit be like hey I see that you're making intrusion

detection stuff I see what you know that's how they really get the highly [Music] that's not the case but those are pieces to the puzzle world the more important they become that becomes more important

so that's what we won't even want to follow things we want to follow things and want to follow people here's an example of the b-sides Twitter page and it becomes a rabbit hole you start calling these people found those people seeing who's sharing stuff now another thing we want to talk

job fairs out there more often than not the bang for your buck is going to be on this is focus on your skill sets you know and I'll speak about Maya the job boards how these things work in general you know so we used mine as an example but this is having work in general so what we did was we have two jobs one is for folks with security clearance so if you've got a top secret digital power whatever we resumes are put on there you identify your skill set the only leaving with access to that chocolate companies who's hiring folks cage number fed all those types of things you know so in the Reese's company flight to be on the air

so it's hard to find people with a with a pile of nerds they have got they come I could find somebody with the skill but I can't find with the clerics to and then why is that if you've got desire you're not you know so they come to those job a few years ago we started to really be good in intentional about targeting inside the community and so we have a second job working cyber second job which is just very low center people but those friends of tools are the ones that you do more like they want to be on as opposed to just a giant you know huge job words for everything when you people

like you want to be a doctor but not on the psychics creepers not

it's not a question if you're trying to get into the peer world it is almost impossible and the reason for that is so the way the government contracting works is the government says hey Bob if you can hire you somewhat to do ethical hacking I'll give you a hundred dollars an hour for example right so I do what I find you to do it for $75 an hour that's how every contractor basically works but it takes years to get these clearance levels like this opportunity so if I hire it's having to give you 75 bucks I can't have any over 75 bucks now for two Eva that's because it takes so long so if you're saying

like what could I do to get includes your best set 20 goes back a networking this is where you find those companies you may be playing both worlds and they can find something for you to do that's not clear but they also have cleared work so if they say wow okay so let's say that they're talking tomorrow but they know he knows somebody but they say well Carla Carl's already here he's doing a good job and we can see a future for him let's go ahead and sponsor his plan because they can still use him for two years but that's kind of a rare occasion when how companies to be better so that's another one of the ER but that

explains why it's so hard to just jump in why people say in the to government contract so the decision I've had this clearance level to work at the site you can get on the site to work on the computer they can get around yes that's a great one if you do a search for jobs with using your own boolean logic and you use the word eligible for you know we're willing to obtain that's a way to find that - it's a Kretz a great point question there I was also gonna say so if you can adjust your expectations you can apply for something a little lower level that's another great way to do - but I'm gonna

get understanding the whole process you start to understand why it could be so difficult to do those things so going back to why you want to be you know this is where they're using some of the sources around they're putting in those key words they're saying show me every resume that has CISSP or whatever the keywords are showing the living with these stairs so without these clearances in this location we can even do it by salary that you're expected to force our location you know [Music] you want to be on those sites now

[Music] they're looking for you are good job the company hire these people and that's a great they want to talk to you too that's why sometimes actually make hires that same day if they're given if the company's built that way because they've brought somebody with just here's overtime got a busy day to come stand behind the table hey a $3,000 you know it to be folks so they're doing a right they're looking to hire by the way our food is good at our job fairs but so this is an example for keyword good tassel penetrations Hansel pin test in three different ways the boolean type surgery you can see this is what the rest mates come up at the results 342

residents in that search and they can see the key skills linking to your education eyes they're going to use this to make a determination and then when they were one about to be the key word to be highlighted in yellow this is how a job for the resume search engines work internal African traffic systems and companies will work in a similar way so this is one you want to make sure that when you're creating your resume we're going to talk about this in a little bit you want to make sure you using those keywords I mean it's more than just keywords the keywords kind of thing you found but they'd always doesn't get hired so you gotta have a little bit of

both but the keywords are important and you can see how when there's 342 they're just in this one search you know you can see why a recruiter is going to just kind of be sipping through things to figure out do I want to take my time [Music]

here she doesn't want to level job 23 years problem looking for somebody senior I might say wow this job calls for you know lots of experience so that's just a little peek behind how job boards work this is an example and what we do companies we're going to be there but also the jobs are looking to fill so when you're going to go to a job but also ones are looking to fill so having this technology which is a big company that's has got work here in Augusta to might I believe you know so they've been have jobs but it was in San Antonio this is what they were looking for so if you weren't saying don't be

we're gonna go to the job fair you did you know before a test engineer if you would want to do a little bit a research job you want to look at that in this technology corporation to find out okay what's the company like what's going on so when you walked up to talk to that person job there you were ready to talk about hey I'm a test engineer if you don't start off with you know currently present yourself as the test engineer because that's having a the information which is out there you want to take advantage of that you definitely want to take advantage of that all right resumes resumes residents do so the recipes don't get you jobs they

get you interviews that's all they do nobody tired no no recruiting to resume to the and she just says Center the form to fill out for Human Resources star tomorrow they're gonna want to talk to you right so but the rest is really good certainly don't confuse the rest in the terrible story of your life you just want to focus on the job that you're looking to get now if you were on a job or talked about your second you can make it a little broader because you're searching for it but when somebody says you know hey Sheila we've got a test engineer position I think you'd be great for can you send us your resume you want a system resume

that just talks about your test engineer experience if you may have done other things you know some of which might be InfoSec related which might not even knock knock you want to care about so whenever looking at the resume to go bam yes BAM yes as opposed to listing all the other things that you may have done and they get confused why can't tell is she of engineer or is she more on the you know administration side or she wore on the I'm getting confused by this stuff you know so you wanted to steal it now if you're the military sometimes at that guy one of my favorite quotes is you know sometimes the coolest thing you did

in the army has nothing to do with the job that you're applying for [Music]

it doesn't belong on there because they don't think he can do it in a combat environment surely you could do it here Augusta Georgia they don't think that they just wanna you can do the jobs if you want to connect it off you can just a single job list your skills the search right up front how many people here heard those stats and the resume is look better six seconds or less right is that fair

[Music] an entry-level well they say six seconds or less on your resume they're not making a decision to hire you or not in six seconds but unless usually not because they've got specific Department you got at the printers you gotta have a bachelor's degree or you got to have five years experience as he tested here whatever the case may be so recruiters are good a finger got do you have those things if you do you don't go into the yes pile you just go into the maybe pot and if you don't you go up so you can make that decision in six seconds no or maybe what's your name more time let's take a look at this so

you want to make sure that your concerns right up front the best in Japan so they can see yeah you belong in the baby pottery and then you can fight your way out of that remember like the rest things responsible for is not in the Congressman my renovation which is a responsible for you know it is the gentleman responsible for videotaping right now right you know there's people did you take an all over the place yeah the video done was he still responsible for it yeah he was he just didn't get done you know so responsibilities just describe to the job doesn't say how well you did the job so you want to tell people you can tell me what the job

entails but then you want to have specific bullets about what you did the story how you did it what tools you use want to talk to her crews that hire people that's what they want to know they want to know what did you do what tools did you use to do it what kind of environment were you working in a team and what was the result not just I use this tool okay not just I'm certified in this you know you can become a certified ethical hacker then you could never have to be hacked for years you know they want to know what did you how to do use this tell me the story of

what you did because that hired manager when they talk to the recruiter they're saying you know what our team is doing this we got this is going a little loop in this direction I want someone's gonna fit in the back so that's why they need to know those things for the better

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yeah that's a great question suppose you didn't hear it was if you're coming out of school for example you don't have the experience but these job requires you talking mitigate that we don't want the short answer is you don't if it requires nice truth if you don't have the experience at all dead you know but not every job requires it does that so where you going to really touch we're looking for entry level positions now that being said don't discount some things that you can do I've talked to recruiters environment research say things like if you if you build your own sandbox you know when you run tests if you do things put that on your resume tell the story

that you need to tell them I build this I tested this I did business and what I found if you're in school and you're a member of a club you know it's doing things list those projects list the classes or two you know if you are volunteering at b-sides if you give a person a community side list those things now will all of that stuff are they going to say well that's the same as ten years experience no but he's going to beat you past have any experience at all you will so you can listen to them on the resonator and you can use a number different ways to put it on there you can certainly list those things that

you're doing and that's why you should be building sand boxes with volunteering the b-sides and being members of clubs and doing intern work and volunteering for folks a short answer that if we want to talk afterwards to get more in depth like I did but the short answer is you're going to do stuff in your home it really comes down to really take the time to describe how you did it you know tell me tell me on the resume that I did this I use these tools this is what I wanted this is what I wanted to accomplish even if it's real world or just sandbox stop saying that because what you're trying to get out there is

someone says and especially for that that that entry level or that slightly above entry level position or they say wow this person cares so much about it that he did these things and just setting it up himself you know show that he's got the drive to do things that he knows more than someone who's never done so it's not like it's not going to like to becoming a sister right away but it can get you in a place that you want to go and the other thing that you can do with those things is if you do that and you get any kind of help doing it you know if you partner with somebody or

you can list that stuff and the biggest thing in we said resumes get you interviews not jobs if you could tell just enough story then that you get to the interview that we got raises manager says more like tell me more about how you get there and then you can get into the weeds about this - love that language in this you know all that kind of stuff it you know they're gonna really get into so if you want to just pique their interest um is that your question shortly yeah if you want to talk more afterwards I can give you some more ideas all right so we talked a little bit about do great work and you

know even if you buy the team of 17 people that do great work you know that's not what he's flying for all the people that wants to do and why sits on there it might be the arrest a shorter one did to Maggie's is fine you know if you want to make a longer one to put on the job board like you're dealing with cyber tech jobs we've got a lot of experience if you want to list everything what you've ever programmed in their resume come up but if they reach out to you and say hey we want to talk to you about this specific position the first thing you want to say is let

me see if you ever have a specific in that position you know if you go to a job fair to talk to somebody you know network engineer position let me put your resume together just for that let me tell you you wanted to steal it down there so it's going to be very possible that you're going to have three four or five seven great resumes but don't be afraid to take time even if you've got a different kind of pull it back to you but you know what but let me send you a better one tomorrow question so you tell me the position you're applying for yeah good question so if you're looking at our

position it's hard to really tell look at what the responsibilities are this is where you know the the more work you can do the less likely this is going to happen you know if you're if you have a network that all you haven't talked to anybody at all your your body both laughing job description that's a really tough thing to do so your best guess which you can do this is where the more you talk to people you know you're gonna know more about hey if you're if you're an abacus corporation what tools are you guys using right now you know so I got my goose neck to be tuned we put that in there so it's asking those questions if

you have no idea you know I don't think it's I don't think it's a bad thing to try to reach out to people if you're gonna do some site groups and career intelligence if you find somebody on leave in if you find a recruiter if you find if you want to call the HR department you know you want to call the department that's doing things the worse they're going to do is tell them now but if you call that say hey I've seen that position what kind of tools you're using on that so I can tailor my resume if I happen to use tools - there's a good chance we might be like wow sure let me talk to you about this you

might have been getting an internet before you switch your resume you know but again when you see the movie signs when you see people in class when you see instructors and they're doing something ask how do you guys do what do you use I wish I could and that's

because those situations

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[Music] you want to leave in your experience at the fair you resume you can put by the way I got a bachelor degree this is my master's degree in that you know developers know de villiers records is the bhp back of the day people either list their references here seven people you call then they became references available upon request those things just kind of send an email and it's all super secure because of litigation and stuff like that so there's no need to list our son president another question that people ask about is cover letters and if you ask a hundred recruiters probably 180 lot cover letters that the best way to put it is the times and cover letters

are very useful or when you have something to say if you have something to say because you're applying because you're because you're going to apply for a job in in Minnesota that you're currently in Augusta Georgia you know the reason you're applying for that job Minnesota citizen group families that come in at home are me and you just can't wait to go back home to Minnesota say that because otherwise people to go why is this girl from Georgia for exactly of everybody apples right so if you're transferring from one thing to another another thing is if you're going to get you're taking the stuff down going backwards down to a technical position you might want to tell you know

I realize it like my last job is in management but you know what I realized it or maybe does the travel that I had to do with this other position be waiting for art to love let's just pull whatever they told me the careers in the makin cover letter and all its going to say is to whom it may concern I think

all you're doing so if you have a reason for a cover letter tell your story you know when it really comes down to as it comes down to individual preference and if you're a hired magnet or do you want to see those things I would recommend you say that in the job description please send me a cover letter I value those things you know but there's a lot of people who in the bigger room the recruiters are just going to add fun things they're finding resumes so I do one of those things if you want my savior tell me what you want because if you're going to give it otherwise people are going to be like well I don't have

much to say and it's not a standard anymore it's not you shouldn't expect everybody to have a cover letter all right so I got a we're all done by the way resonates here this is a great opportunity

years of experience but basis of this roughly % it breaks down things like it's killed right up front you can see you can see how if you want to put your skills in your how long you've been doing it but if you're hiring baby you can see that right there you can figure out in less than six seconds do I want to look at the rest of this regiment that's kind of is designed you can do a one-page resume so stop by and see me I'll give you a copy to this to take back with you and then last couple things were kind of right at one time [Music] focus on the job too when they ask me

questions like what's the what's the most impressive thing you've done answer the answer is the most impressive thing you've done in terms of intruders intention not like the fact that you can go before or if you were you know if you're in the military or the fact that you know what you want have you sinned you know you shot somebody or something like that you know people say those you know they're still directive that's what they did there's nothing wrong with that they went to their country but it's not what you bring up a TV interview because all of a sudden you're talking about down there intrusion detection when you're done you know any questions for

me

where do you see yourself in five years right pretty easy question how about you castle hey we're DC's company five years we move into this we're moving in is not clear just a preview movie that's showing that your image so make sure that you have questions that you write it down ahead of time so you can kind of kick them off when they says you have questions yes I do it matter of fact I had six you've already answered three here's two three let's go on in there that's gonna share something and then follow up when you're done with the interview send email say thank you for your time can remind people you know most people nowadays just send an email

anybody gives you their business card send them in an email back if you would team in or maybe there's like three people now I'll give you your business card when you're done you know dear Jim thanks for taking the time to talk to me I was really impressed by what you guys are doing I really enjoyed it seeing that you guys been doing this the next five years and then reiterate I really want this job let people know you want the job so remember when you go to hear also proven then maybe you don't want the job hey after listing what you guys are talking about that's what I want to do I appreciate your time they're gonna

appreciate that too because they don't want to hire you when you quit so follow up now you got the job the biggest thing you get the job

we're almost out of time here